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The modern news consumer ignores Weblogs and online citizen journalism at his own peril. But not everyone has the time to keep track of what's going on the Web. With this blog we hope to track the highlights of what's being discussed online so when news breaks from the Web, we're ready.

Will Femia is a Weblog enthusiast who, through good fortune and dumb luck, was introduced to the form as his position as chat producer for MSNBC.com careered into obsolescence. On any given day, Will can be found having already spent an unhealthy amount of time squinting at a computer screen.

Send a message to Will at spotter@msnbc.com



Leave those hicks alone

Posted: Tuesday, February 13, 2007 2:20 PM by Will Femia

I waited all morning (and into the afternoon) for the fine folks at Crooks and Liars to share the Stephen Colbert clip from last night in which he tears into Australian Prime Minister John Howard (after first tipping his hat in agreement) for criticizing Barak Obama.  It's a brilliant illustration of some of the sentiment I saw expressed in the blogosphere yesterday, for example this piece at Captain's Quarters.  Like Joe Gandelman, I felt myself give a mental Scalia Sicilian salute to Howard when I read the story.

I had similar feelings watching this video of some British guys who decide to taunt people in Alabama and end up nearly killed (sadly confirming some of the gross stereotypes they set out to mock).  Most folks online see it as a funny joke but I couldn't help but feel a little defensive.  Hey you jerk, those are our hicks.  If they need mocking, we'll handle it.  Why don't you go find some soccer yobs in your country to provoke into threatening your life?

UPDATE:  That YouTube link is dead but DailyMotion has the whole episode of Top Gear in two parts.  The Alabama segment is in part 2.  Scroll the timeline about an inch (sorry, no counter). Part 1 is here if you want to watch the whole show, which is about a half hour long.  The show itself does an interesting job waking the line between funny and offensive and I can't quite decide if it would be different if the players were American. 

Speaking of Barry, there was a talking head on Hardball last night who predicted we'd eventually see his speech from 2002 versus Hillary's speech of 2002 and she'd come out looking bad.  (They were talking about whether her answers on the war would be sufficient in her campaign.)  Anyway, here's the Obama half.

Speaking of Iraq, here's the PowerPoint slide show of the government's case for Iran in Iraq.

The science of Godzilla.  Better than the science of zombies.

Ethnomusicologists against music as torture - It took me the longest time to figure out what I thought this was weird and finally I realized that the objection seems to be about the abuse of music, not about the abuse of humans.  It's like People for the Ethical Treatment of Music.

Speaking of uncommon causes, Ezra Klein raises the issue of prison rape with a few anecdotes from victims.  Prison rape is such common knowledge it can be the poster joke for a Hollywood comedy.  I can't think of any politician who would dare stand up for the rights of the incarcerated; being "tough on crime" is such an easy political point to score.  Still, it's pretty sick.

World Press Photos of the Year 2007 NOTE: Several disturbing war photos

Speaking of professional photography, I don't remember what brought me here, but I've been enjoying The Online Photographer blog.

The only thing I want to hear from a urinal cake is flattery.

Someone's going to have to explain OscarTorrents to me.  Are they seriously offering every Oscar nominated movie for download for free?

The brain scan that can read people's intentions - This is as "Minority Report" as it sounds.  I'd like to see the actual study because the connection between what the brain scan shows as "intention" and the resulting action is not clear to me.  Surely there's not much more than a split second between brain signal of intention and actual action.

IT, YouTube and the wealth gap - In what way does the digital divide contribute to the wealth gap.  The blunt argument is that the wealthy have more access to technology which makes them more productive and more efficient at making more money.  The actual situation may be more nuanced.

Candy heart for Valentine's Day.

Dear Boston authorities, this is a marketing trick.  Don't panic (or cause panic).

Speaking of that mess, Osama Team Hunger Force - NOTE:  There is occasionally NSFW material on CollegeHumor and just below this video are four random photos that may contain a thong or something.

How to crash an in-flight entertainment system

While checking out the new techPresident site mentioned in yesterday's Times (the hook was that they track the number of MySpace friends each candidate has) I appreciated the candidate blog round-up that goes with the follow-up item that one of the embattled Edwards bloggers quit.  The most interesting angle on this whole story now is whether campaign blogs (and bloggers) have to be boring by definition.  In the ideal there's an idea that candidates having blogs will mean candor and insight and I have to say that part of why I didn't think the Edwards bloggers would be a big deal is because I thought they'd be advising in the background, not actually cultivating personalities of their own online as part of the campaign.  Of course candidates should be doing their own blogging, that's the whole point.  For all the jawing politicians do about opening a channel of communication with the people, this is the one tool that will actually allow them to do so in a manageable way.

FBI lost 160 weapons and 160 laptops in last 44 months - and that's the good news.  "In any organization the size of the FBI, equipment is going to be lost, misplaced, or stolen, so perfection is not to be expected."  I'm not sure I agree with this one.  I'm sure there are corporate formulas for what an acceptable amount of loss is, but I'd expect weapons and laptops to be particularly well guarded.

Canterbury tales in World of Warcraft.

Stem cells used for 'natural' boob jobs - It's funny that in almost every place I saw this story they included a gratuitous photo of a large breasted woman.  I didn't even think it was a legit story, but after some Googling I was able to find out quite a bit more information.  When you think about it, being able to grow breast tissue and even a whole breast is actually a really big deal in terms of fighting breast cancer.  The "excesses of vanity" angle does the research a disservice.

Speaking of growing new body parts, "Researchers ... have now shown that continuous tooth generation can be induced in mammals."

Hysterical parody of someone calling IT for help with a book.

I'm not sure I really understand the reason for building a V6 hybrid sports car other than to refute the reputation that hybrid cars are wimpy.  Still, doesn't this kind of defeat the purpose?  (And don't get me wrong, that's a hot car. I'm just saying...)

Top 10 Fashion Suggestions for Nerds - The site is kind of weird and made me wonder if it was some kind of spam, so I clicked through to the blog.  The whole thing is an AdSense Earnings Adventure.  Pretty fascinating if a bit cynical.

Commuter Click: How Not to Talk to Your Kids - The Inverse Power of Praise.  This is the second NY Magazine Commuter Click in a row, but since I liked the last one I'm sticking with them.

*** Can anyone settle this bet?  In the Pink Floyd song, do they say, "Hey, teacher, leave those kids alone" or "Hey, teacher, leave them kids alone" or what?  Does it depend on what version of the song you hear?

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Those, I think, regarding Pink Floyd.
Soccer yobs actually kill people but don't tell the Euro's. They are still smugly assured they are better than us. Whatever....
Will - I'm pretty sure it's leave THEM kids alone. It would go better with the 'we don't need no education' line.
Speaking of Speaking of, please stop all of the Speaking of. It's annoying. It makes me want to stop reading your column.
Those kids.
From http://www.pink-floyd-lyrics.com/html/another-brick-2-wall.html Another Brick in the Wall Part 2 (Waters) 3:56 ... No dark sarcasm in the classroom Teachers leave them kids alone Hey! Teachers! Leave them kids alone! All in all it's just another brick in the wall.
I believe the lyrics say 'them kids', but when the kids are singing in the second chorus it sounds like they are singing 'us kids' - which might be why it sounds funny. My husband says it's whatever is printed in the lyrics, even if it sounds different. (grin)
"Can anyone settle this bet? In the Pink Floyd song, do they say, "Hey, teacher, leave those kids alone" or "Hey, teacher, leave them kids alone" or what? Does it depend on what version of the song you hear?" In the movie the captions say 'them kids' but I think in the live version they say both.
Regarding the Pink Floyd song, I think it's both "Them" and "Those" depending on the verse (if that's the right word). The first time through the lyric it's "Them" and the second time "Those".
Paul, I saw that link when I googled the line, but what kind of authority is that site? The Pink Floyd site has a few lyrics, but only for the re-released albums, not The Wall. What's interesting to me is that there is almost the same number of Google results for "hey teacher leave those kids alone" as there is for "hey teacher leave them kids alone."
Joe, we covered that long ago and not only was it decided that readers are OK with me having a catch phrase but someone created a "Speaking of..." Cafe Press account that has it on t-shirts (http://www.cafepress.com/buy/Speaking+of/-/pv_design_details/pg_14/id_8960631/opt_/fpt_/c_360/)and mousepads (http://www.cafepress.com/buy/Speaking%20of/-/pv_design_prod/p_storeid.33343955/pNo_33343955/id_8958405/opt_/pg_/c_/fpt_). I have one of the mousepads. (None of that stuff is official or in any way sanctioned by MSNBC.com.)
Will, you happened to ask a question about my very first favorite song. The phrase is sung basically four times, and it's "them kids" three times followed by "us kids." I'm really excited about the tooth regeneration news: it's my medical dream!!
I think it's "them".
Will, As for the Pink Floyd reference, the song actually contains both "them" and "those".
Will, I have the album of the Wall. The printed lyric in the insert sheet matches what is on the site exactly word for word. I used the link so you could see the whole lyric. I think this is just copied off the album insert sheet. Regardless of where they got it, it matches the album. I note that one of the reasons people are often confused is that they are shouting that particular phrase. In concert, their voices were pretty ripped by that point (I suspect drugs may not have helped).
I love it when Americans get all upset about people having a go at them!
I have to disagree with the Fashion4Nerds shoe advice. Sandals, with or without socks, are nerdware. In fact, sandals on men are a deal breaker for many (though not all) women. A less polarizing choice for summer feet would be lightweight canvas sneaks, like Vans or Converse.
Scott, I confess I was surprised at myself for feeling that way.
Gotta agree on the Top Gear story - the video has been pulled now, by the way. However, who's the redneck here: the jerks who went down south looking to pick a fight - and then running scared when they succeeded beyond their wildest dreams - or the folks who were just trying to be left alone but who suddenly found themselves invaded by British snobs. I love the Top Gear program and jump at the opportunity to view ANY of their various videos across the web. This was way out of line and definitely not what I expect of them. And...yes...Alabamans may be rednecks, but their OUR rednecks. Leave 'em be.
Almost all of your comments have to do with the Pink Floyd song or the British/hick story (which isn't even on youtube anymore). WHERE'S THE OUTRAGE ON PRISON RAPE? Everyone too scared to stand up about it? Too weak morally to say THIS MUST STOP? Too SPOILED and more interested in just dallying in the net-world to take a stand in the real world? Too vicious to CARE? Too titillated to CARE? Good for you to link to it Will, but even you sort of back away from it.
It's both those and them in Another Brick in the Wall (Part 2).
"I love it when Americans get all upset about people having a go at them!" - actually I personally never mind when people have a go at Americans or our President. But, a leader of another country trying to meddle in our political process using outrageous rhetoric is pretty bad. It is equally bad if our leaders do that in other countries, and they rightly get called on it if they try (of course, past Presidents were far more subtle). Unfortunately, this case just shows how far down Aussie politics have come when Mr. Howard cannot just state that he disagrees with Mr. Obama's position (and why), but has to dive for the gutter by stating that the terrorists are hoping for the Democrats to win. Maybe next time he can tape a commercial pretending to have had sex with Mr. Obama by making suggestive comments and winking...
Sean and Jodi are right - they use both 'them' and 'those' at different points in the Pink Floyd songs ....
Personally, I like the "speaking of" segues. Keep them coming! Secondly, it's amazing to me how many people are willing to ignore prison conditions without ever having been inside on. I had the opportunity to tour a prison in high school, and it made quite an impression on me. Our prisons, it seems to me, have lost sight of their main purpose as centers of rehabilitation. What chance do convicts have when they are released to the same world or worse than that from which they came with no new tools? I could go on forever about this, but our prison system absolutely needs an overhaul. Are there organizations out there that are taking up that purpose on a significant and meaningful scale?
Arguments over the exact lyrics in 'Another Brick in the Wall' in like Catholics and Lutherans argueing over the Bible. Anzways, whatever is printed is open to interpetation by the 'artists'. I think this confirms our propensity to create religions in the absense of one. What kind of monstrosities will the religions we are creating in the here and now be tomorrow...
Holly, for what it's worth I did receive mail from people about the prison rape item. They just didn't comment here. It's a touchy subject. I mean, it's not like there are any major movements in the U.S. that follow a leader who had any compassion for criminals and sinners.
both them and those
With regard to prison rape (and conditions), this is not a compassion issue. Legally, prisoners are supposed to be treated free of "cruel and unusual punishment". It would seem that refusal to protect prisoners from such acts is cruel and certainly unusual in a modern society. That is, the founder's model would suggest that they are protected in the same way that people on the outside are (in terms of safety, food, shelter, health care, etc), but not coddled. I think the real problem is that politicians are afraid of appearing to "coddle criminals" (or the term favored in attack ads is "soft on crime").
I googled: "leave them kids" "pink floyd" = 16,600 results "leave those kids" "pink floyd" = 12,600 results I can't decide what this means. Also speaking of prison rape, it is outrageous.
Will--I've been saying for quite a while that sports cars are an obvious use for hybrids. Electric motors provide full power at any speed--and thus, strong acceleration--and acceleration is where normal cars guzzle most of their fuel, so sports cars are inherently fuel-guzzling (because what's the point of a fast car if you barely ever touch the gas pedal?) Add to this the fact that sports-car-seekers are inherently inclined to want something different, unusual, and technologically-superior, and they're willing to pay premium prices for it, and hybrid sports cars seem like a no-brainer to me. But then, I suppose there is probably plenty of market research that could explain to me exactly how wrong I am....
I've got the "Speaking of . . ." mousepad too!
It's both "them" and "those". Everybody wins!
I live in Alabama. I have yet to see as many "rednecks" here as I did when I lived in NYC, Milwaukee, Chicago, San Diego and Dallas. It really irks me that everyone has to be politically correct (ridiculously so) at times to avoid insulting a particular group, yet all it takes on TV or in the movies to point out which character has the lowest IQ is to make sure they have a southern accent...and usually an awful fake, at that. Even the "good" cartoons for kids seem to use this ploy. Rant over.
Wow, lots of comments, anyways, the oscartorrents site is created by "The Pirate Bay". The movie companies are not giving them away for free, they are probably seeding some fakes to collect IP addresses for the future though. While downloading digital data is not technically stealing, it is still contributing to or a form of copyright infringement. You wouldn't want to take a few cents from the millions those actors and producers make, would ya. heheh. Hope that helps with the legality question.
Regarding Another Brick in the Wall (My most Favorite album and movie!!) Depending on which version they say, Leave the kids alone , leave us alone. The lyrics I have don't have them or those in them. Doesn't mean mine are correct though. Maybe we hear those and them when they are saying the and us???
Regarding the Top Gear piece (and I love the show by the way, wish I could see it on a network here) I agree with the sentiment that if you go looking for a fight and then it actually happens, you shouldn't be offended or upset that others get upset. I was actually more upset that they knocked our food then our people. You are really going to make the arguement that English food is more edible?!? REALLY?!?
I can't say it definitively, but it seems as thought you should change the title of this entry "Leave them Hicks alone"!
1) I have to disagree with Shelley, sandals on guys are great! 2) It those and them and us. 3) Don't go to prison in the first place. 4) Rednecks are everywhere.
What the American public don't realise is that John Howard's comments actually had nothing to do with you. He has an election against a well liked opponent coming up, so of course he falls back on the old "I'll keep you safe from the baddies!" ploy all pollies love to use. Do you really think the Australian PM has any effect on your democratic processes?!?!?!
The UK has an abundance of white trash--where do you think all the American version came from? I've lived in England and the US. I've been "escorted" out of Evanston, Wyoming by several truckloads of locals. I've been threatened with harm on a London commuter train for answering chit chat with an American accent. I also been chased in Manchester for not being local. Beckham is a Northerner with a mullet, who happens to be decent at football. As the local Alabamans would have said, Top Gear had it coming. I like the show, but I agree with Clicked and the locals. That production was low class.


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